Leigh Walton is Vice President of Global Government and Regulatory Affairs for Pitney Bowes. As Vice President of the Global Government and Regulatory Affairs team, Leigh leads the company’s work in influencing public policy to increase opportunities for its shipping, mailing, and financial services businesses as well as to mitigate risks to those businesses. Before joining Pitney Bowes, Leigh was a consultant to companies in the technology, education, and health care sectors. She also served in several state government and political roles, including as Legislative and Political Affairs director for Missouri Governor Bob Holden. Leigh serves on the boards of the Public Affairs Council, a national nonprofit that provides training and education to government affairs executives, and the New England Council, the voice for the region’s business community on Capitol Hill. She served for ten years, with two as Co-Chair, of the Governor’s Prevention Partnership, a Connecticut nonprofit focused on mentoring the state’s young people.
Leigh holds a B.S. in Political Science from Truman State University in Missouri. She lives in Boston with her family.
[00:00:12] Welcome back to another episode of The Political Life. Today we come to you, well, I think it's Massachusetts. We have Leigh Walton with us today. Leigh has been, well, I won't say how long she has been at Pitney Bowes, but Leigh Walton is with us today and she heads up Pitney Bowes. She is the Vice President of Global Government Affairs. Basically, I don't know, she could tell us, but all of government affairs, international, federal,
[00:00:42] state, she helps, I think, oversee it all, but she can correct me if I'm wrong. She's been with Pitney Bowes for some time. I won't say how many years, but I do know. And of course, Maggie Mick, the star co-host, is with us here today also. And Leigh, welcome to the show.
[00:01:00] Thanks so much, Jim and Maggie. Such a pleasure to be with you. Looking forward to the conversation.
[00:01:05] Yeah. So, first of all, when I see what your title is, I just break into a sweat just reading all those things, but maybe as a lobbyist who operates in one state that, you know, it's understandable. So, what is it like? It seems like you have to work in three different, very distinctive buckets.
[00:01:25] We do. Well, you know, I work for Pitney Bowes, which is an iconic Connecticut-based, shout out to you, Jim, shipping and mailing technology company. And so, based in Stanford, Connecticut, born in Stanford, Connecticut, a lot of our company's DNA is really around innovation.
[00:01:42] And so, when you think about a piece of mail that you might receive, maybe your utility bill, or maybe, you know, maybe Maggie got that gorgeous sweater she has on, you know, through Nordstrom and you see a shipping label.
[00:01:53] There's a lot of intelligence and information in all of those labels and in what we call those indicias on a piece of mail, where that article was entered into a network, how much was paid to send it, who sent it, all those kinds of things.
[00:02:06] And that's all highly regulated. And so, I do lead the government affairs function for Pitney Bowes, lead it globally.
[00:02:13] But to be fair, I think anyone that has a job like that knows you have to really be aligned with your internal clients and you have to pick your places.
[00:02:21] Unless you have a huge staff of a couple hundred people, you're not going to be able to be impactful everywhere.
[00:02:25] And so, we have certain jurisdictions and certain agencies and certain legislatures where we really focus our work and happy to spend a few minutes talking through those.
[00:02:34] But great company, been there for quite a while. And I stayed there, frankly, because I've gotten to have about five different jobs while I've been there.
[00:02:40] And so, the key for me is if I can always keep learning and doing something different and work with great people, that's a place I want to be.
[00:02:46] Yeah, five different jobs. You keep moving up. So, how do you keep track of three distinctive different areas? Is it difficult or how do you do that?
[00:02:56] It's not easy, but I'm sure you know that. I mean, every legislature, every agency, every jurisdiction is complex and different.
[00:03:04] And so, part of it is really having a great team of human beings that you work with and great external consultants who both understand the rules of the road in that different jurisdiction, the culture of those government agencies.
[00:03:15] And then, most important to me, it's really alignment with the client because we have to share that work, right?
[00:03:20] The team isn't big enough for us to do it all. So, it's picking your places, really being aligned with how am I creating and helping the business articulate what their agenda is, what the company's agenda is, what are the goals?
[00:03:33] How can we solve their problems? Who are the people who are experts in those jurisdictions?
[00:03:37] How can I contribute and our team contribute to profitable revenue growth, to reducing expenses?
[00:03:43] How can what I do really make the company grow and thrive?
[00:03:47] And then, who do we need on the team externally who knows the rules of the road in that jurisdiction, who can kind of shepherd us, who can tell us and look around the corner?
[00:03:55] Because I think a good lobbyist doesn't just partner with the business to help the business grow or reduce expenses.
[00:04:01] A good lobbyist also helps their clients anticipate their future problems and opportunities.
[00:04:06] And so, to get back to your question, Jim, you know, what we do is I think we try to be pretty rigorous and pretty reasonable about where we can actually put that focus.
[00:04:14] So, for our team, it's quite a bit in Canada and the U.S. and a little bit in the U.K.
[00:04:21] It has been in the EU as well.
[00:04:24] But really, having those, what I would say, those quarterly conversations with our clients.
[00:04:29] Where are our clients? What do our clients need? Where are we growing?
[00:04:32] Where can we also, if you take a two-by-two chart, what actually is going to make the biggest impact on our business?
[00:04:38] And where can we actually make a difference?
[00:04:41] Sometimes we drag along when we know others can take the lead and their interests are just the same as ours, maybe through industry associations and other things.
[00:04:50] And sometimes there's really no other company who's going to have our back, so to speak.
[00:04:53] And those are the places where our team and our clients make those joint decisions to put our resources.
[00:04:59] So, I think it's really being pretty rigorous and being really in alignment with your client.
[00:05:04] And just acknowledging there's going to be things we aren't doing.
[00:05:07] Because if we try to do everything, we'll succeed at nothing.
[00:05:11] Well, it's such a smart answer and really informative.
[00:05:18] And I have to hand it over to Maggie here because I'm sure Maggie, who also deals with a whole multiple Fortune 500 companies across the U.S.,
[00:05:30] was kind of nodding her head during your response and your answer.
[00:05:35] So, Maggie, I'll let you follow up from here.
[00:05:38] Well, and thanks, Jim.
[00:05:40] In terms of the business that you are executing on behalf of your clients, in this post-COVID world, here we are in 2024 versus where you were in 2018 or 2019,
[00:05:51] how has the actual business changed?
[00:05:54] And then how has that impacted government affairs in the company?
[00:05:58] Sure.
[00:05:59] That's a great question, Maggie.
[00:06:00] So, we actually purchased a company in 2018.
[00:06:06] And so, we were really invested not just in the technology space, but in addition to mail logistics.
[00:06:13] So, think of a mailing sorting center or if you're a campaign person, a mail house.
[00:06:16] We have about 40 of those across the U.S.
[00:06:18] We were also touching packages in a multi-carrier fashion, but in a lot of ways in a partnership domestically with the United States Postal Service.
[00:06:27] So, as we saw COVID take over how we all shop, how we all lived, we also saw, you know, really, really unique and kind of ebbs and flows of conversations around tariffs and the de minimis threshold and customs and duties.
[00:06:43] It meant that we really needed to be nimble and swift.
[00:06:47] I had served in Brussels on a quarterly basis for a few years on the World Customs Organization's e-commerce working group.
[00:06:53] And so, we had some really good relationships as a result of that, and not just me, but another colleague of mine.
[00:06:58] And so, when COVID hit, we were, I know, able to call upon a couple friends in Canada, a couple friends, you know, in the EU to get, you know, really some help.
[00:07:06] So, we all saw our volumes really explode.
[00:07:09] And then we've all kind of come down and we've settled back into some normalcy.
[00:07:12] So, the technology and the core business of what we do, you know, remains the same.
[00:07:17] Our core business has to be approved to go into the market, that technology, in each market in which we operate.
[00:07:23] So, we have about 12 basic markets where we operate, and we usually need the post's approval to be in that market, whether it's the service business or the technology business we're in.
[00:07:33] Then, in a number of markets, there's regulated pricing around the mail.
[00:07:37] If you remember, only the post in a certain country can actually put something in your mailbox.
[00:07:42] And so, with packages, it's a competitive environment.
[00:07:44] Great companies like FedEx and UPS and others are in that business along with different posts.
[00:07:48] So, the team that I lead has, we influence regulated pricing in a few different jurisdictions, especially Canada and the United States.
[00:07:56] Our team also is responsible for shaping postal, e-commerce, trade and customs legislation to benefit our business.
[00:08:06] And then finally, Pitney Bowes has kind of an interesting quirk.
[00:08:09] We actually own a bank based in Utah.
[00:08:11] It's an industrial loan corporation.
[00:08:13] And so, we also influence in the United States and in the state of Utah around that bank.
[00:08:19] It's really part and parcel to the business proposition that we put forward to our clients.
[00:08:23] So, Maggie, some of that shifted.
[00:08:25] Some of it stayed the same.
[00:08:26] The velocity got very, very quick because, of course, we needed to stay sorting mail and packages seven days a week as we always had.
[00:08:33] And so, every day, it was what jurisdiction is doing what to be sure that we can both remain open for business and then protect our people.
[00:08:40] So, it's certainly like most other companies we've been through a lot in the last five years.
[00:08:45] Things have settled down a bit.
[00:08:47] But the core business of needing to get market access for our business, help them remain in compliance and then shape policy and shape pricing remains.
[00:08:57] And, you know, really happy to do it with a really small and mighty team and some really great external experts.
[00:09:03] Part of jurisdiction to work in globally down to a locality, if you will.
[00:09:09] You know, I have to say, I kind of, you know, I'm a Midwesterner.
[00:09:13] I grew up in a town of 250 people with no stoplights.
[00:09:17] I love states.
[00:09:18] I'm a state lobbyist to my core.
[00:09:22] I have to say there's such a great variety between states that can be shocking.
[00:09:27] Coming from the state of Missouri, where I was privileged to work in the administration of Governor Carnahan, and then I was legislative director for Governor Holden.
[00:09:33] And going to Connecticut was a real shocker.
[00:09:36] I remember looking at some legislation and kind of thinking, oh, that doesn't have a chance of passing.
[00:09:41] And having our lobbyists say, oh, yes, it does.
[00:09:44] So it's a real education for me.
[00:09:47] I think what's difficult is just the mastery of rules.
[00:09:51] Once you master the rules and the culture of where you're lobbying, and then you think about the target you're lobbying and what they need, hopefully the skills we all have are transferable.
[00:10:01] And so, Maggie, I don't know that I have a particularly, you know, one-eye dread because I love doing the work that we do.
[00:10:08] But certainly, I'm newer to Washington, have just started lobbying on a daily basis there about seven years ago.
[00:10:16] And that's been, you know, an interesting challenge for me just in a different way.
[00:10:21] But I'm a geek.
[00:10:22] I love to learn wherever I go.
[00:10:25] Well, the town changes every four to eight years anyway.
[00:10:29] Right.
[00:10:29] And where internationally will you be spending a lot of time in the coming year?
[00:10:33] We have a project, a pretty intense project in Canada right now.
[00:10:37] And there's a fantastic guy on our team who has the lead.
[00:10:40] But like with anything, you know, the team shifts.
[00:10:43] And I'll put my time, you know, where it's needed in support of him.
[00:10:47] And we may or may not have an administration change in Canada, I think, as most folks know.
[00:10:52] And so that will take up quite a bit of time.
[00:10:54] A little bit less so in the U.K.
[00:10:56] We just had a project there last year and one in Australia as well.
[00:10:59] We're, you know, working with the regulator, you know, working with the government.
[00:11:02] So, you know, things tend to pop up.
[00:11:05] And then there's the constant.
[00:11:06] And the constant for us is Washington.
[00:11:07] It's where the bulk of our time is spent and the bulk of our energies and our budget as well.
[00:11:12] So you touched on Missouri and working in a governor's administration or two, in fact.
[00:11:24] But you also have some history in presidential campaigns and politics.
[00:11:29] Can you share a little bit more about your time with the governors and in Missouri?
[00:11:34] And then we'll maybe dabble into presidential politics a little bit.
[00:11:37] If we're not already past campaign season, I mean, we can just stay there for a second.
[00:11:42] So I went to college in Missouri.
[00:11:44] My sister had actually was working in the Illinois State Senate, and I ended up doing an internship.
[00:11:51] I actually went to Jefferson City.
[00:11:53] My mother grew up on a farm in Missouri and got matched with a pretty amazing human being.
[00:11:59] Didn't always align in our politics, but really a fantastic mentor.
[00:12:05] And I just was privileged that people took a chance on me when I graduated from college.
[00:12:10] And that's just a pretty simple lesson in life for me that I've just been over and over again, people have taken a chance on me.
[00:12:16] And it's my turn to pay that back with different people.
[00:12:19] So I got a job out of college I never should have gotten, really wasn't qualified to do.
[00:12:24] I was the legislative liaison for the Department of Corrections, so the prison system.
[00:12:29] So at age 21, 22, I was lobbying around methamphetamine, a tragic scourge that still lives with us, chain gangs, and sexual predator civil commitment legislation.
[00:12:41] So I really had to learn and had to learn really quickly and had a great time for about 10 years in Jeff City.
[00:12:50] Just incredible human beings, so many great mentors.
[00:12:54] And again, you know, just had the real privilege of working in Governor Carnahan's administration.
[00:12:59] And then, you know, what's unique about governors, I think, and then Governor Holden, again, took a chance on me.
[00:13:04] And I'm just really struck.
[00:13:06] You know, when you're a governor, you know, you are a governor for all the people.
[00:13:11] You have campaign promises you make that you want to fulfill.
[00:13:15] You live through challenging events that you can't predict, like a flood or a hurricane.
[00:13:21] And those people that are Midwesterners remember the flood of 1993.
[00:13:24] And then you're the head of the party as well.
[00:13:27] But I always say working for the governor, it's both heavy and hilarious.
[00:13:32] And heavy, I mean, you know, your client are the people.
[00:13:36] And so you really need to think about what your clients need and want and anticipate their needs.
[00:13:41] And I remember I was staffing Governor Holden on 9-11.
[00:13:45] We were meeting with the Rural Legislative Caucus.
[00:13:47] And someone interrupted us to tell us about a plane crashing into the Trade Center.
[00:13:52] And we didn't know what to make of that.
[00:13:54] I mean, let's face it.
[00:13:56] And I just I remember that day we were in a special legislative session.
[00:14:00] And you go immediately into a different mode, as I'm sure we all remember.
[00:14:05] And then the hilarious.
[00:14:06] I remember an older woman telling an elected official I worked with once that she was so excited to meet him.
[00:14:13] She peed her pants.
[00:14:14] She peed her pants.
[00:14:15] You know, it's just people kind of lose their inhibitions.
[00:14:21] And, you know, what do you say back to that?
[00:14:23] So not much.
[00:14:26] But I'm from the government here to help.
[00:14:33] So those were great, great opportunities.
[00:14:35] And, again, where people just gave me, took a chance on me, gave an opportunity.
[00:14:39] And my job was to work as hard as I could.
[00:14:42] And really rewarding time and really essential time in terms of learning.
[00:14:48] And, yes, had the opportunity to work on campaigns, a couple different ones, and most notably one in 2004.
[00:14:53] And just what an immense amount of respect I have coming square off what I know is a fairly divisive campaign in our country.
[00:15:03] I think that campaigns are, if we run them well, they are good for the country and they present choices.
[00:15:11] And I think the job of helping to educate people around the choices that they need to make is a noble thing.
[00:15:19] Sometimes campaigns get a bad rap.
[00:15:21] But I had a pretty tremendous experience working on the one that I did some years ago.
[00:15:27] And, you know, I still, you know, as we all, I hope, do from time to time, we'll volunteer and help.
[00:15:33] And I believe that there are really great people that are in public service.
[00:15:37] And I believe part of our jobs is to support those folks.
[00:15:41] And so, again, another great opportunity I have from a mutual friend that Maggie and I noted that gave me, again, an opportunity, gave me a chance.
[00:15:51] That's such an adept observation about campaigns and a good reminder of why we do them, that they're there for the health of democracy and that they present a choice.
[00:15:59] I think that is a very timely and eloquent way to put it.
[00:16:06] So, Lee, you also, I think you co-chaired a substance abuse prevention task force or council with the governor of Connecticut, Governor Lamont.
[00:16:20] How did you end up doing that?
[00:16:23] And what did you learn in that role?
[00:16:27] You know, I first, I think, became more aware of substance abuse issues when I was working in Missouri and the methamphetamine crisis hit.
[00:16:38] And it was a crisis and still is in some places.
[00:16:41] People stealing fertilizer to build a meth lab and just the devastating consequences that substance abuse can have on all of our communities and really all of our families.
[00:16:52] One of my best friends' nieces has served time behind bars because of her addiction.
[00:17:00] And that is, unfortunately, she's been struggling for over 20 years.
[00:17:04] And so, you know, it hits home for so many of us in so many different ways.
[00:17:09] Jim, a mutual friend of ours, Joe Brennan, actually called me.
[00:17:15] For those that don't know Joe Brennan, he was the longtime head of the Connecticut Business and an Industry Association and an outstanding human being.
[00:17:22] And Pitney Bowes was one of a couple of handfuls of companies that started an organization under Governor O'Neill in Connecticut called Drugs Don't Work.
[00:17:31] It morphed into a group called the Governor's Prevention Partnership.
[00:17:34] And Pitney Bowes had supported it and was still supporting it.
[00:17:38] And Joe thought that I would be a worthy board member.
[00:17:42] And so I did that for about eight years.
[00:17:44] And right after COVID hit, our current board chair was retiring.
[00:17:48] And I certainly was thrilled to take it on.
[00:17:53] And Governor Lamont is such a great mentor himself and such a great leader that it was a real pleasure.
[00:18:01] This group actually kind of trains the trainers.
[00:18:04] So if you think about teachers and principals and police officers and ministers and rabbis, like these are all people that hopefully our kids connect with and they trust.
[00:18:14] But sometimes even adults don't have all the answers.
[00:18:17] But what we know and what research tells us is if kids have someone that they can turn to, either a classmate or a teacher or someone else that can help them, they're much less likely to turn to drugs and alcohol.
[00:18:30] And we know if we can get them through those difficult years, because, you know, especially those teenage years can be really difficult years.
[00:18:37] And we can get them through that and help encourage them that they can hopefully go on and become adults and live a life, you know, substance abuse free.
[00:18:46] And, you know, so it's a passion of mine for sure.
[00:18:50] And I think too many of us know people who have suffered.
[00:18:53] And this Governor's Prevention Partnership has done some really great work, not just under Governor Lamont, but Governor Malloy and Governor Rell, who we just lost within the last couple of weeks.
[00:19:02] It's been a really great Connecticut-based nonprofit.
[00:19:05] And I was really privileged to get to lead it for a few years.
[00:19:09] I actually had a question just about, you know, you having a successful career in both the public sector and the private sector.
[00:19:16] What do you think are the key differences between staffing up a principal at the presidential level, the gubernatorial level, and the corporate level?
[00:19:26] And what are some characteristics of successful staffing for all three of those principals?
[00:19:31] Oh, wow.
[00:19:32] Well, I wouldn't tell you that I am the expert, but I will tell you a little bit about what I learned.
[00:19:38] And I know this from the little bit I've gotten to know you today, Maggie, is that I think part of the key is really working with schedulers, working with the folks who are chiefs of staff and administrative professionals that support executives, whether they are private sector executives or public sector executives.
[00:20:00] I think part of good staff work is about setting good expectations, educating your principal well, whether that principal is, you know, is a governor or an agency head.
[00:20:12] What are the goals?
[00:20:14] Where are they going?
[00:20:15] How are you giving them the right context for different meetings?
[00:20:18] You know, is there clarity?
[00:20:20] Are you doing good politics, you know, while you're there?
[00:20:22] If you've got an official event, how do you mirror that with a political event that's touching folks locally because all politics is local?
[00:20:30] Touching that state rep locally because you might need that person's vote and because you should care about what they're interested in.
[00:20:35] Making sure there's, you know, maybe a good opportunity for fundraising on the side as well.
[00:20:39] It's really, though, a principal's most important resource is their time.
[00:20:44] And so respecting that time, respecting the people that help them stay focused and being consistent, true to your word and creating opportunities that have measurable results, you know, help the business objectives, help the policy objectives, you know, whatever it is.
[00:21:02] And then thank you notes, right?
[00:21:05] I mean, you want to remember your manners for the people that have helped you and the people that you've gone to visit.
[00:21:10] And so if it's a private sector or a public sector person, we all, you know, should want to keep our ears open and keep learning in every meeting and keep saying thank you and understanding what different people need.
[00:21:24] Because along the way, we all need to ask for help sometimes.
[00:21:26] And it's a heck of a lot easier to ask somebody for help when you've maybe done them a favor or when you've cared enough to listen to what's on their minds.
[00:21:34] So thank them for the last favor.
[00:21:36] There you go.
[00:21:37] Exactly.
[00:21:39] Exactly.
[00:21:39] I think that just goes a long way in life.
[00:21:41] It's just the right thing to do.
[00:21:44] And Lee, when you're looking to hire someone at state level, what are some of the traits that you're looking for in your lobbyists or the lobbying firm?
[00:21:58] And what are some things that are kind of red flags for you, if you can think of any?
[00:22:05] You know, for me, just in general, attitude is almost everything.
[00:22:09] I don't expect any person that we hire, whether it's a staff person within the corporation or whether it's a contract lobbyist to exactly know our business.
[00:22:19] I expect people to do their homework and do some research and have good questions.
[00:22:23] I think that always reflects well.
[00:22:24] But having an attitude and an attitude that they want to learn is so important.
[00:22:30] I also just think it's always important to listen and to understand culture, culture of the firm that you're hiring, culture of the company that I work for is in a match.
[00:22:47] I definitely I listen to the way people talk about other people.
[00:22:52] Do they talk about them in a positive way?
[00:22:55] Do they see the good in people?
[00:22:58] Obviously, we all check references, you know, but.
[00:23:03] Everyone has something to teach you if you listen.
[00:23:07] And I'm always looking for a partner.
[00:23:09] I don't have all the answers.
[00:23:11] Nobody on our team has all the answers.
[00:23:13] So looking for a partner that is hungry to learn, has a great attitude.
[00:23:17] Yes, has those local relationships and connections, but is fairly humble as well.
[00:23:23] I mean, it really does take a team to succeed in this business.
[00:23:26] And I want somebody that's going to give me a hard truth and going to, in a kind way, say, yeah, Lee, your impression, that's not going to work.
[00:23:35] Or I'm not sure it's going to work, but I might suggest this tweak.
[00:23:39] And if we can't have an honest dialogue in a relationship and people put their egos to the side, I want to win.
[00:23:44] And I want to win for our company.
[00:23:46] I know who my client is.
[00:23:48] And I want to hire somebody that respectfully gets that and wants to win, but wants to win in the right way.
[00:23:58] All right, I think Maggie's going to close us out.
[00:24:01] You want the two capstones.
[00:24:02] Okay, so on every episode or pod, whatever you may call it, we end with two final questions for our guests who are often busy traveling the 50 states or, in your case, maybe traveling the world.
[00:24:19] Where did you go to last?
[00:24:22] And what was the best meal you had on that trip so that if someone's going to where you've been, they can check it out?
[00:24:28] And where are you headed to next?
[00:24:29] So if someone wants to connect with you on LinkedIn and make a friend, they can give you a travel tip or a restaurant tip.
[00:24:36] Awesome.
[00:24:37] Well, it's been an odd year.
[00:24:41] Our daughter does synchronized ice skating, and we've had some interesting menus.
[00:24:47] We've been to Atlantic City and Las Vegas.
[00:24:49] One was for volleyball.
[00:24:49] So I feel like we hit the gambling capitals of the world this year.
[00:24:53] I will say in Vegas, Ocean Prime, I think, is a really good bet.
[00:24:57] We have one here in Boston as well.
[00:24:59] So it's a small chain for those of you that don't know it.
[00:25:01] But we were actually visiting my dad last week.
[00:25:03] And so we went out.
[00:25:05] I don't know if it was the best restaurant.
[00:25:07] But if you like beer, it's called Half Wall, H-A-L-F, in DeLand, Florida.
[00:25:13] And beer galore.
[00:25:15] And they also have their own.
[00:25:16] And so I'll say we had a pretty good casual meal there.
[00:25:20] And tomorrow morning, I'm on the 6 a.m. flight to D.C.
[00:25:24] And I think we'll all have the opportunity to grab dinner with a couple of my teammates
[00:25:28] and my boss, who's our general counsel.
[00:25:31] And so I feel like I spend quite a bit of time in D.C., always happy to have more recommendations.
[00:25:38] If you're not doing a fundraiser and you can actually grab a meal with a friend,
[00:25:41] I consider that a great night.
[00:25:42] No offense to doing fundraisers.
[00:25:44] We all do a lot of them.
[00:25:45] But sometimes it's nice to just peel off and have a good meal with one other person.
[00:25:49] And there's an Ocean Prime in D.C.
[00:25:52] Yeah.
[00:25:52] Oh, haven't been that one.
[00:25:54] Yeah.
[00:25:54] I think it's like ninth and F, maybe.
[00:25:59] Well, thank you for joining us.
[00:26:00] It was a pleasure getting to know you today and just wish you all the best.
[00:26:04] Oh, thank you.
[00:26:05] I appreciate the opportunity.
[00:26:06] I've known Jim for a long time.
[00:26:08] Maggie, great to meet you.
[00:26:09] And I just have a lot of respect for this podcast.
[00:26:11] It's fun.
[00:26:12] I love learning from different people you have on there.
[00:26:14] And I'm thrilled that you let me spend some time with you today.
[00:26:19] Well, Lee, thank you.
[00:26:20] Thank you for joining us.
[00:26:22] It was great having you.
[00:26:23] And to our listeners out there, we will see you next week.